This Blogger Meets the President and then Builds a Digital Product Empire, with Monica Froese

#46: Monica Froese is a blogger and Pinterest expert who has built a multiple-six-figure business online by helping working moms thrive in motherhood and business.

We’re going to cover how meeting the President of the United States led to her launching a business, the number one thing she focused on to turn traffic into product sales, and how to get more email subscribers from Pinterest.

If you’re the type of person who wants to grow your own digital product empire and build a business that gives you control over how you spend your time each day, you’ll definitely want to stick around for the rest of this episode.

Podcast Episode Summary

In this episode, you’ll learn:

  • how she grew her email list and re-discover the power of an email list;
  • why Pinterest isn’t for everyone and how to know if it’s right for your business;
  • the two things that matter in Pinterest marketing strategy; and 
  • how having fewer CTA on your page increase your conversions.


What I realized about blogging was that it’s essentially just marketing. (08:58)

I would say when I figured out the email, not only was it the fact that I was building a community that, you know, I wasn’t owned on a different platform, but I was able to let my real self shine through in ways that I really couldn’t put in a blog post, which is structured for SEO and for what Google wants. (13:32)

At the end of the day, Pinterest is a search engine, period. So if your stuff is searchable, you can absolutely still be found on Pinterest and beat the competition who cares. (20:32)

I recognized that once I got people on my email list, and this is where I feel like a lot of bloggers and content creators miss the mark here, if you focus on once they’re on your email list, the sky is the limit for what you can sell to them. (27:43)

One call to action. And when you simplify it like that and get just hyperfocused on that one metric that’s when things grow. (29:22)

Connect with Monica Froese


Ep. 46: This Blogger Meets the President and then Builds a Digital Product Empire, with Monica Froese

Monica (00:01):

How many times do you get offered to tell the leader of a free world what's wrong with what you've been ranting about online for the last two years. And then I left the White House and I decided, okay, this is clearly a thing.

Josiah (00:14):

Welcome to Content Heroes, everyone. We're back with another great conversation to help you build a profitable business on your own terms by creating content online. Our guest today is a blogger and Pinterest expert who has built a multiple six-figure business online by helping working moms thrive in motherhood and in business. We're going to cover how meeting the President of the United States led to her launching a business. The number one thing she focused on to turn traffic into product sales and how to get more email subscribers from Pinterest. If you're the type of person who wants to grow your own digital product empire and build a business that gives you control over how you spend your time each day, you'll definitely want to stick around for the rest of this episode. So let's jump in.

Announcer (00:59):

You're listening to the Content Heroes podcast, where entrepreneurs, marketers, and creatives share how they build profitable businesses on their own terms by creating content online. And now your host Josiah Goff.

Josiah (01:14):

I'm here with Monica Froese. Who's a professional blogger at Redefining Mom and a Pinterest expert. And I'm super pumped about this conversation. Thanks so much for being on the show today.

Monica (01:23):

Yeah. Thanks so much for having me.

Josiah (01:25):

Awesome. So let's get started with your story. How did you get into blogging?

Monica (01:30):

I had a rant to share. That's literally how it started. So it was my daughter. My first daughter was born in 2012, late 2012. And I, at that point had been in my corporate career already almost eight years. 'Cause I started my corporate career while I was still an undergrad. And I ended up getting really bad postpartum. It's postpartum PTSD, not depression. There's a difference. We don't need to talk about that. But regardless, this sparked my rant about the lack of maternity leave policies in the United States. And then I found out working for a Fortune 100 company that I had been afforded really great. Great. And I think air quotes, maternity leave. And I was like, wait, this is what we consider good. It was just the topic I had never really explored prior to having babies. And I got really mad about it. And so I was, what do you do when you get mad? It's like, well, I'm going to start a blog. Back then. It was kind of, there was a lot less education about blogging, I guess. And it kind of felt like to me, almost like the live journal, what a live journal was back in the day. So I started it and it got traction very unintentionally and it actually led to a few really cool opportunities, as I say, without trying. Cause I really wasn't. It was just, I was getting found because I had a rant. I got to go on a couple of national news spots. And then I got invited to the White House, which was the huge turning point in the whole thing. It was in 2015, I got invited as press, which was mind blowing that I was considered. To me it was mind-blowing I was considered press as a blogger. And I ended up getting invited to a private session to meet with the President, literally to tell him what I thought was wrong with the policies in this country for working moms. And I was like, Oh, I got lots of stuff to say. And he said to me, he's like, Oh, you're a spunky one. Huh? I'm like, well, I mean, how many times do you get offered to tell the leader of a free world what's wrong with what you've been ranting about online for the last few years? And then I left the White House and I decided, okay, this is clearly a thing. I'm going to make this a thing. And I am going to help women. What it ended up becoming was I felt like I'm going to help women reclaim control over their own destinies, which meant that if corporate wasn't going to give you what you want it to structure your family and the way you want it and you still want it to work because I'm very passionate about women's right to work. Well, go do your own thing. Like let's take your skills and repurpose them into this online blogging world. And that just kicked off my business. Really. It was not well thought out necessarily in the beginning, but it's turned out to be the best thing I ever did. And here we are.

Josiah (04:18):

Oh man, that was that's so amazing. What was it like getting to meet the President?

Monica (04:21):

Very nerve-wracking. I will say, I tell people that so. It was an event that I was invited to. They don't tell you that the President's even going to be there for national security reasons. And so I didn't know if I was going to meet like Michelle Obama or if there was just going to be like senior officials there. Like we had no idea when we arrived. We were told four days before. So like I had to take time off of work. I actually put the email in spam. This was the funny thing. So it came to my blog email at the time, which wasn't even like my domain email. It was a Gmail account. I get this email inviting me to this White House event. And I'm thinking, well the White Hhouse doesn't email people. I spammed it. And I happened to be getting lunch with a coworker. And I said, yeah, I got this like spam White House email. And she said to me, she's like, maybe you should check to make sure that it's not real. And I'm like, okay, here I go. Google, how to call the White House, get to the White House switchboard ended up getting to the person who sent me the email and I'm like, Oh, it's a real thing I need. So I almost didn't even go. That's the crazy part about the whole thing. The most pivotal thing in my life. I mean, aside from having my kids, like, don't get me wrong. My kids were pretty pivotal too, but I would have just spammed the invite and gone about my merry way and not been any of the wiser. So it was intense because I kind of went in without a lot of expectations, not even knowing if he was going to be there, but quickly, I say, when you get to the room, this, it was in the Eisenhower building, which is across from the West Wing. But I did end up going into the West Wing, which was cool. When you get there, Secret Service locks you down. They're like you could not drink, you could not go to the bathroom. And I'm like, I have to go to the bathroom. They were like, well, if the President shows up, you will not be let back in. And I'm like, Oh, okay. So he is coming. Like, they don't tell you anything. It's so weird. He ended up showing up giving a 20-minute speech and then I was tapped and they said, we would like you to go over to the West Wing and do a small round table with the President. And I'm like, excuse me, like, what are you, what are you asking me right now? And I did, I got to like go past the armed guard into the West Wing. And it was, it was, it was nuts. It was really cool. It was very nerve-wracking though. I'm not gonna lie.

Josiah (06:33):

Yeah. I'm sure. That's amazing. So it sounds like it really helped to bring a lot of clarity to the vision that you had for your blog and your business experiencing this. I'm curious what your next steps were like, how did you go about turning this into a business, like a full-time thing.

Monica (06:52):

Okay. So I left definitely on fire. Like I knew, I will say I've always had an entrepreneurial spirit. Like if you talked to my dad, he tells you like some funny stories I did when I was a kid, like I was never destined to be in corporate and deal with the politics of corporate. Like it just was not, but also my dad did desk job his whole life. And it was like, you know, you follow. You be the good girl. You put your 30, 40 years in and then you retire and go about your life. Like, that was what I was told was the way to you, I was fortunate to have the job. I did, you know, all those things. Yeah. So I left very much on fire, but very much not, I didn't know what to do. And also my job was very demanding at the time. I traveled a lot. I ran very large scale events. And so there wasn't a whole lot of time for me to really put much effort into it. And then about five months later, a blogger that I had followed for a very long time for couponing of all things, because that's what I did for a hobby before I had my daughter, I was like, I'll coupon on the weekends. She launched a blogging course. And I remember this is just it's so it's so wild thinking back because I remember she opened it up for a limited time and she's opened like a hundred spots. It was $297. And I remember like knowing the email was coming out and spending the money and being terrified to tell my husband, cause I thought he was going to be like, you spent how much on what? You know, like, are you nuts? And so I bought it without asking. I mean, I don't ask permission anyways, just to be real, but I definitely was a little concerned about his reaction. So I bought it and then kind of gently was like, so by the way, I bought this thing. And he kind of looked at me funny, like, uh, okay. And I said, but I'm going to do everything it tells me to do. And I did. I am very good. Like when I make up my mind, like you give me a plan, fine. I will follow it. I'm a rule follower at heart. And so I did everything that I was told to do in this course. And I deviated it along the way at points. Like, as I started to realize what the big pivotal moment for me was, what I realized about blogging was that it's essentially just marketing. And I'm great at marketing. I mean, that's, I marketed large scale events in corporate. And once I piece that together, I was off to the races. Then, then I really knew that this could be a thing and let's see it. So three months after I bought the course, I quit my corporate job after 11 years, which was the scariest thing I think I've ever done. And definitely a lot of people in my life told me I was nuts. And I started a work from home job in the same industry. I was in tech at the time. And that was a train wreck of a situation. And I knew I could not keep working at that company. So I was even more motivated to turn my business into profit. And at the same time, my husband just happened to get this amazing job offer. And so I ripped the bandaid off. I was just like, I am going to quit my w two wages. I call it completely. And I also am very like, I don't fail. I refuse to fail. Like that is my mentality going in. The biggest rub my husband and I had actually was that I had offers for our marketing contracts early on, because that was my skillset in my last industry. And I turned them down because I said, I am going to build a brand. This is what I told them. I'm going to build a brand and it's not going to be reliant on other people paying me. And he's like, you're turning down thousands of dollars and you're not bringing anything into the family. And you kind of just didn't really discuss this. You just did it. I was like, yep. And I was so stubborn. I was like, I am going to build this into something and you're just going to have to get on and ride along until, and now he'll tell you, he's like, well, I'm really glad you were stubborn because it surely has paid off. I just refuse to fail. I don't, I don't know how else, because when I look back and sometimes I feel like it seems deceptively easy and it certainly was a lot of work, but it's all building blocks. Like one skill builds off the next. And before you know it, you have a business. I don't, this sounds so simple, but it's not, I get that. It's a lot of work, but you have to believe in it first, I think is really the key.

Josiah (11:09):

Yeah, absolutely. For the people listening, who've heard a little bit of my story. Definitely some similarities there because I did the same thing where, so I just ripped the bandaid off as well. I left my job without a plan. Had no idea what I was going to do. But there's something about that where when you remove that safety net, it forces you to figure things out. We're such resourceful creatures, like we're wired to survive. And so when you put us in those situations, we're going to figure it out. We're going to figure out how to make it work when everything's on the line. And so I love that you did that and that you basically burn all the burn all the boats and said, there's no going back. It's so important to get to a point where you make that decision. If I had tried to start my own thing on the side, which I had done multiple times before that, while I was still on the job that was like, sucking the life out of me, I would have failed. It wouldn't have gone anywhere. I'm not the type person who can, who can divide my attention like that. There's some people out there who are, who are great at that. But I feel like they're more of the exception rather than the rule. I mean, I love that. I'm curious, was there a point where during your business where you're like, Oh, this is actually working and this is, this is going to be a thing. Like, do you have any of those moments?

Monica (12:22):

Yeah, for me it was when the email list clicked because I actually don't enjoy typical blog posts because what happens to me because I'm very high fact finder in high follow through. So when I start writing a blog post, I think, how am I going to rank on Google for this? Like everything, I'm everything wired for ROI, like coming from corporate, it's all about the ROI of the task I'm going to do. So in my mind, I'm thinking, okay, I have to write this post, but it has to serve me in some way, in order for it to serve me, I have to do the keyword research. And then I have to like, how can I guarantee that I'm going to rank? And then it will be for nothing. And I would like psych myself out to the point where I really didn't like writing blog posts because I felt like I wasn't getting a big enough ROI from my time spent. When it clicked for me was when I realized the power of email list, my email is to this day. There's really no way for me to a hundred percent say how much my email list makes, but I would venture to say, it's at least 85% of my business income could probably be very closely tied to the fact that I have an email list at the end of the day. And it was way less stressed to write an email. I could be myself in the intro. I would say when I figured out the email, not only was it the fact that I was building a community that, you know, I wasn't owned on a different platform, but I was able to let my real self shine through in ways that I really couldn't put in a blog post, which is structured for SEO and for what Google wants. And that really was like the beginning of me building a loyal fan base through email. So that was the pivotal. That was definitely a pivotal moment for me. I can still remember being afraid to send my first email.

Josiah (14:02):

What was going through your head when you're going to send your first email?

Monica (14:05):

Nobody's going to want to hear anything I have to say. And I had a coach at the time who said, uh, didn't the President ask you about what you wanted? what you had to say? And I'm like, but that's different. She's like, no, that is not different.

Josiah (14:23):

That's the best coaching line ever.

Monica (14:27):

Yep. That, that's what got handed back to me. And I was like, yeah, okay. Maybe you have a point. I also remember very early on getting invited to a summit. And at the time I had an email list of like 450 people, which I was super proud of. Anyone who's getting started should be super proud of that. And I remember them looking at, we were on a video call and I remember them looking at me, cross-eyed like, that's something to be proud of. And I remember thinking in that moment, well, I'll show you. I'll grow my list. I just like challenges like that. Like I don't do failure. So I'm like, well, next time we talk. I'll have thousands of people on my email list.

Josiah (15:04):

I love it. How did you go about growing your email list, I'm curious?

Monica (15:07):

I would say in the beginning, it was definitely what I would call like very typical blogging type ways to do it, which is, you know, a content upgrade in blog posts. But I really did hone in on Pinterest at the time. So at this point we're like leaving 2015 entering 2016. It was really what I call like the heyday of Pinterest. This is before the algorithms really cut people off of just like massive amounts of traffic you could get started. I mean, you could really explode your traffic pretty fast on Pinterest then. It was the heyday. You know, every platform has their heyday of just like free, everything's free. And from there, once I realized the connection between when I got people from Pinterest, everyone else in my space, every blogger at the time and still, I mean still a thing, I would say they, all focused on traffic and I'm like, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, time out. What exactly does this traffic get me? Like they come to my site. Great. But do I get anything from that? No. So what do I want them to do? Well, I want them to get on my email list. I got hyperfocused on if someone's going to come to my site, they're going to give their email. Like, that's all I cared about. That one metric. My overall conversion metric from all traffic in to who got on my email list and I blacked out everything else. And so I got super focused on that. So of course what you focus on you grow. So I my list grew fairly fast at that point. And then I just covered these wonderful things called promoted pins, which is Pinterest advertising, which was very baby back then, like kind of sadly, a very, there was not much you could do with promoted pins, but no one else was using them. So I'm like, what are these funny things that I could pay for and get more people on my email list and how do I master this? So I got hyperfocused on that, which led to a bunch of people asking me, how did you do that? How did you do that? Cause that's what people do. Right? And when I was pregnant with my second daughter, that was in my third trimester and a good friend of mine in the blogging world came to me and said, can you make a course on how you do your Pinterest ads before you have the baby? And I told her she was off her rocker, that I was about to shut everything down and go into extreme nesting mode. And there is no way I'm creating a course right now. And she begged me. She begged me. And I really credit her with a lot. I mean, her begging me to do that of course was like a big catalyst in my business. And the shift of really being like a sole proprietor to being like an actual business, that course changed pretty much everything on two sides of the house, it gave me this revenue stream, you know, to sell the course, but also it honed my skills even further in advertising and targeted traffic, which exploded my brand side. It was a good idea. I came to realize.

Josiah (17:58):

That's awesome. So up to that point, were you mostly focused on affiliate sales? What was your business model before?

Monica (18:03):

Okay, so early on, I've always kind of been very attracted to owning my own products. I'm all about, I'm a control freak. I've come to learn actually through this business. Well, I didn't want to rely on Google. And then I'm like I realized I was being reliant on Pinterest for traffics. And then I'm like, well, if I pay for traffic, then I have more control over it. I felt like control freak. And then I'm like, Oh, I own my email list. So what else can I own in this process? Oh, I can own my own products. Instead of sending people off my site or off my email list to go buy someone else's stuff, I'll just create my own stuff. So, so that's what I did. So the very first thing I really took off on the redefining mom's side on the blog side was I came up with a course to help other moms get out of corporate that were in similar predicaments as I were. They really want it to work. Like it wasn't a question that they didn't want to have a career. As I said at the time when I was in corporate, my life, much more favored work than it did my family. And I wanted the balance to shift a little bit more in the middle. So that was pretty much what the course was founded on and was really the basis of, I would say like the first loyal fan base that I developed and then a lot of small digital products I had for moms along the way. And then it shifted into Pinterest products after that. Now I still sell both, too. I have like very distinct like lines of business because of that.

Josiah (19:28):

So Monica, I'd love to dig into the Pinterest side of things because that's something I'm really curious about. The first thing I'm wondering is, you know, you talk about Pinterest having its heyday and how, you know, all of these platforms when they start out, when they start getting traction, everything's free. And then they have the Facebook model that everyone's learned at this point where it's like, Oh, now that you're relying on us for your business, we're going to start, you know, holding back the flood gates and charging you for it. So for someone who would say, Hey, it's saturated. It's not worth going down the Pinterest route at this point because there's just too many people doing it. What would you say to them?

Monica (20:03):

Well, that is wrong. So it is wrong. Here's the thing. In its heyday, in any platform today, it's almost stupid, easy to get traction. Like there's not a whole lot of strategy at the end of the day that you really need it to get traction when they were just opening the flood gates to free traffic. So what it becomes, and I believe this with every platform that ends up starting to gate the free days is the strategy just simply becomes more important. And at the end of the day, Pinterest is a search engine period. So if your stuff is searchable, you can absolutely still be found on Pinterest and beat the competition who cares. I mean, as long as your people, I much look at Pinterest as a user comes to Pinterest with a problem, they're searching for a solution. You, your content or products, what you're offering is the solution. How do you show up in those search results? It's really that simple at the end of the day. And then, you know, Pinterest has caveats. It's a visual search engine. So I often compare it to Google. Like here's an example, bullet journaling. When you put bullet journal into Google, you're asked to buy an actual physical bullet journal. When you put bullet journaling into Pinterest, you're presented with these beautiful bullet journal layouts, this inspiration. And so if you're on Pinterest and you're selling bullet journal stuff, then your goal is to inspire people, to click on your pin, to get to your site. And then you decide what the action is that's going to be taken. It's a different mentality than Google, but at the end of the day, it's a search engine. So as long as you know how to show up in the results, the problem that people are searching and inspire them to take the action to get to your site. That's all it is.

Josiah (21:46):

Yeah. That's great. Do you feel that Pinterest only works for a few select types of audiences? Like the demographics lean heavily towards the female side? Or do you feel like there's room for most types of businesses to do well, maybe not as the primary channel, but enough, they get enough of return that would be worth investing.

Monica (22:08):

I do not think it's for everyone. And I will say one of the ways I find it easy to weed out, if someone really knows what they're talking about. If they're selling Pinterest services or courses and stuff, is when they say it's for everyone, no, then they don't really know what they're talking about. My opinion, I would be leery of people that say that. I mean, at the end of the day, Pinterest really at its core is still heavily skewed into the United States. Women, I would say is more diverse than it used to be. But really like the core is still women like my age in their twenties, thirties in their forties who have buying power. So they make household decisions. Oftentimes what happens is because I'm a Pinterest marketer, people come to me and say two things. I get two things the most, well, my local business do well on Pinterest? Can I sell business services on Pinterest? And my answer first to the local businesses, you'll always get a better ROI on Facebook. Facebook knows so much more about us. There's more people on Facebook. They can get so much more granular than you can on Pinterest. So unless you have a play that your local business, what you're offering can be distributed in a bigger geographical area, which is sometimes the case then fine. But if you're looking for foot traffic into your local store from Pinterest, no don't even like run, that's not going to happen and go to Facebook. Cause that's really where you should be. If you have a business and you have business services, the thing they have to ask yourself in that regard is are the people I'm trying to reach on Pinterest, so like for me, I can be on Pinterest. Cause I'm trying to reach Pinterest marketers, people who are selling their stuff on Pinterest, like they're on Pinterest already. So they will see my stuff. Especially when I promote it. Bloggers are on Pinterest cause they're using Pinterest for their business, but it's not going to be the same for every business. So there are definitely caveats. And I would say internationally, it can be challenging. Like you're going to have pretty good luck in the UK, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland, France. But once you kind of branch off from there, it's going to be pretty hard to target. And the United States is still definitely like their sweet spot.

Josiah (24:13):

Yeah. That's great. So what would you say to someone who is wanting to get started in Pinterest? What are the key things they need to know?

Monica (24:20):

It's a search engine, it's all going to be about, it's all keyword focused. So like every platform they have their ups and downs with what they want to do. So like sometimes having been in the Pinterest world long enough, I would say at times like engagement has been given favorable, getting engagement on your pins, getting comments, getting follows would encourage you to show up in the algorithm, but it's not. At the end of the day, I would say my success and how I have taught is, a lot of videos I put four years ago on my course are actually still very relevant because at its core, I didn't focus on all of the wins of Pinterest. Like we're going to care about comments today, but we're not going to care about tomorrow. We've hashtags today, but we're not gonna have it tomorrow. At its heart all I cared about was having strong keywords and clickable images. That is it. Those are the only two things that matter at the end of the day. You use the right keywords in your pin titles and your pin descriptions. And you have images that inspire which is important, inspire people to click through to your site. That's all you need. And it's been the same for years.

Josiah (25:25):

Love it. I think that's great because so many people get focused on the little tactics that are changing, you know, month to month or year to year. And so I love that advice of at the end of the day, you're creating things that solve people's problems. And so you want to look at how am I solving that problem and how am I communicating that I understand their problem and have a solution for it. And so that never changes. That's always going to be how you get people's attention, right?

Monica (25:59):

Always. And then once you have something that works, so you have proven that you're getting traffic to it, people are clearly interested in it. Then you can go and decide if you want to amplify it with their paid advertising. I often get people that also come to me because very few people talk about Pinterest advertising. So I get a lot of questions about that. And they'll say, do I have to have a Pinterest presence first before I'd run Pinterest ads? And here's the deal like any platform out there, if you're not sure it's going to convert from the platform, it's a risk to put money behind it until you've proven the concept like I'm impatient, I said like, I just want to get to the results. So that's why promoted pins work so well for me, because I was like, I don't want to wait to rank in search. Like that will come naturally. But instead I'm going to promote my pins, force myself to the top of search results and the top of the smart feed. So people see me and I get more action on my pins. So it really all kind of just ties together. So if you're going to promote a pin and you haven't proven that your offer is going to convert on the backend, don't blame the promotion 'cause you didn't do your due diligence, but you could certainly come on the platform and test it just knowing that it may or may not take off because you didn't prove it yet.

Josiah (27:10):

Love it. That's great advice. So Monica, you had mentioned that, you know, your email list is really what has driven your business growth. So I'm really curious, you know, you talk about getting a bulk of traffic from Pinterest and everything that you've done there and also growing your email list. How did you connect those two? Like what's been your strategy for getting people from Pinterest onto your email list.

Monica (27:34):

I recognized early on that the more call to actions you have on a page and distractions, you have the harder it is to get them to do what you want them to do. So for me, I recognized that once I got people on my email list, and this is where I feel like a lot of bloggers and content creators, like miss the mark here, if you focus on once they're on your email list, the sky is the limit for what you can sell to them. Whether if you're focused on affiliates, if you're focused on getting sponsorships, because then you can drive people from your email list to the sponsored posts. I mean, once you own that relationship, which is what an email allows you to do, you can still do all the things you were doing on that post anyway. So where I find a lot of content creators, like they want to send you to the affiliate right from the post or they want their display income and there's too much going on. There's too many what we call calls to actions going on. And then your readers don't know what to do because you're asking them to do too many things. So what I did was I took out, I stripped out all the noise. So you landed on my content. It was very clear that what I want you to do is sign up for my email list. So I would give you what you came for. But the call to action was always to get on my email list because my attitude was once you're on my email list, that affiliate that I was going to put in that post anyways, I'm just going to direct you to it in the first email. And then I'm a director to the next affiliate and the next product I create. And then it's like, the sky is literally the limit because you don't have just that one interaction with them. You have as many interactions as possible until they might want to unsubscribe, which is fine. I got over unsubscribes a long time ago, but that's just how I saw it very early on. So when I got hyperfocused on, I say it all the time to my students, one call to action, one call to action. When I go to a post and it's like, I got popups hooping in here and coming down here and ads here, Whoa, Whoa, guys, this is why no one takes action on your stuff. One call to action. And when you simplify it like that and get just hyperfocused on that one metric that's when things grow.

Josiah (29:31):

Oh man, I love that so much 'cause that was a pet peeve of mine too, because there's, I can't tell you how many times I've landed on a page where I actually am really wanting to read content because it looks like it's going to be really good. And all of a sudden I'm like blasted with, you know, a pop up that takes over the whole screen. And then a bunch of ads and like video ads. And like I having trouble actually scrolling down because everything is crowded and the content takes up like 25% of the screen.

Monica (30:01):

It drives me nuts. I tell my students this all the time too. So a lot of my students want me to talk about how I created digital products. And so they'll send me their sales pages. And the first thing that hits me is a display ad. And I'm like, you're trying to sell your own product. Why are you going to send them somewhere else like, Oh my gosh, take that display ad off of your sales page. No ads should be on your sales page, but it's not common knowledge. And to me it comes very naturally. Like that is clearly my superpower. And I get that doesn't come naturally to everyone. So I cannot drill enough that if you really want to grow an email list and you're getting a lot of traffic, one call to action. How do you get the person arrives on that page to sign up for your email list? That's all, that's all I cared about for like a year and a half.

Josiah (30:49):

Oh, that's fantastic. Well, Monica, this has been awesome. I'm so glad that we had the opportunity to sit down and chat. I feel like we could talk about this stuff all day, but I know that we both have kids who are going to start causing raucus. So before we hop off here, can you just share with everyone where they can connect with you online?

Monica (31:10):

Yeah. So right now everything's still centralized on We have big plans this year to break off to all my Pinterest stuff. And then Redefining Mom can go back to its core purpose of being for working moms, but we're not there yet. So if you want to find me, that's where you can go is to

Josiah (31:28):

Awesome. Well, we'll make sure all that's linked up in the show notes and for everyone out there listening, go be a hero.

Josiah (31:35):

Hey everyone, thank you for listening to the Content Heroes podcast. I just wanted to take a second and let you know that we have some amazing guests planned for the coming weeks. So if you haven't already go ahead and hit subscribe so you can make sure to catch every episode. And if you enjoyed today's episode, go ahead and leave a five star review to help make it easier for other content creators to find and enjoy the show. Lastly, I'd like to invite you to join our Content Heroes Facebook community, where you can connect with other online content creators to share, learn, grow, and have fun. To join the group, just visit Once again, that is

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